308 issues

Discussion in 'Large-Bore/Small-Bore Rifle/Shotgun' started by Ethan Smith, Jan 7, 2017.

  1. Ethan Smith

    Ethan Smith New Member

    4
    Jan 7, 2017
    Hey guys! I am new to this forum but after some issues my dad and I had at the range today I figured this would be a good source of information. I bought a remington 700 sendaro 308 with an aftermarket stock that had 1 box of shells through it according to the previous owner. I'll mention that it had a 6.5 lb trigger pull so I brought it in and had it lowered to less than 3. I brought it to the range and after probably 5-10 shots to get it zeroed I was shooting pretty good groups (smallest was .7 from 100) with some of our hand loads we use in other 308s (150 grain SSTs with 47 grains of H414 using Hornady brass). My dad and I loaded up some new loads (150 Hornady ssts on 48 grains of H380) and cleaned my rifle as well.

    We went to the range and right off the bat my rifle was really struggling. I'm talking like 3-4 inch groups at 100 off a bench. After about 15 or 20 out of no where it shot a group that could be covered by a quarter. We decided to walk down and check it out and when we got back I shot another group. It was about 2 inches on a cooled down barrel (it topped out at 5 degrees here in SD today). My next group I shot could be covered with a quarter again! By this time we used up all of hand loads so we headed home in a state of confusion.

    I know we havent done any load development or even sized the cartriges to my rifle but I was wondering if u guys had any thoughts on the situation?

    Was shooting on an unfowled barrel our probelm?
    Does the hot and cold barrel make that much of a diffrence?
    Or do u think my rifle just doesn't like the current load?
    Any and all advice is appreciated!
     
  2. soundguy

    soundguy Well-Known Member

    May 8, 2012
    florida
    Ladder testing multiple powders will help you decide what loads and powders your gun likes
     
    Kody24 and m77user like this.

  3. Firpo

    Firpo Well-Known Member Supporting Member

    Aug 29, 2013
    Yorba Linda, Ca
    I'd ask if you were getting .7" groups with H414 why did you change to H380? Go back to what worked and remember, "if it ain't broke don't fix it".

    Good Luck
     
    m77user, Broot, ms6852 and 1 other person like this.
  4. PRR1957

    PRR1957 Well-Known Member

    192
    Dec 2, 2016
    Berkley, Michigan
    Did a Google search as "Hodgdon H380 cool temperature characteristics" and found several posting on other forums about powder temperature insensitivity and H380 was on the top of the list.

    I have myself never used H380 but have had good results with VihtaVuori N140 and better results with their N550 in the .308 Win. I had also had very good results with Hodgdon Benchmark in the .308 Win. I live in Michigan and like to have one load for all of the seasons not one for the heat of summer and one for the cooled of winter. I'm also considering IMR 4166 because of their claim that it isn't temperature sensitive.
     
    carver likes this.
  5. ms6852

    ms6852 Well-Known Member

    599
    Nov 15, 2008
    San Antonio Texas
    I agree with Firpo, if it ain't broke don't fix it. Once I know what my rifles like I don't change the recipe, unless it is out of bordem and I want to try something knew and I want to see if my rifle likes the new loads.
     
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  6. Twicepop

    Twicepop Well-Known Member

    Jan 9, 2012
    NW Ohio
    Welcome to the FORUM. A clean barrel can and usually will throw a few flyers. What you've posted is just proof that every rifle does not like every powder. My 308 bolt gun does well with IMR 4895 and really shines with IMR 4064. A buddy used to have an old 308 Savage that would shoot one hole groups with WW 748.
     
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  7. soundguy

    soundguy Well-Known Member

    May 8, 2012
    florida
    4064 and varget are near identicle in my 30-06, but 308 likes 4064 more.
     
    carver likes this.
  8. BobMcG

    BobMcG Well-Known Member Supporting Member

    Welcome to TFF.
    After sighting your rifle in (with a particular load), it sounds as though you settled in to shoot for group size. Makes sense but, now you have a warm barrel that is also fouled.
    The rifle now being sighted in and then cleaned, your second session started out with a cold, clean barrel which is going to change things up a bit compared to the end of the previous session, all the while introducing a different load. Were you out of H414 powder? It's the only reason I can picture for the quick change out from a load that was working quite well in the first place.
     
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  9. Ethan Smith

    Ethan Smith New Member

    4
    Jan 7, 2017
    Thanks for all the input guys!

    My dad did some research on the 414 and found out that it's slower burning characteristic wasn't ideal for 308 (even though we were sucessful with it.) It shoots even better in our 22-250 (my best group measured .55in ) but we were looking to try something new for the new rifle and compare velocities and performance. Might have to go back to the H414 ( we have like 5 lbs on hand)

    Any opinion on matching cartridge length to each individual rifle? Is it worth the pain of keeping ammo separate for
    diffrent guns?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 8, 2017
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  10. soundguy

    soundguy Well-Known Member

    May 8, 2012
    florida
    I keep separate brass for my boltguns...
     
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  11. soundguy

    soundguy Well-Known Member

    May 8, 2012
    florida
    H414 for 308 will work for 155,165,175,180,190 gr projectiles
     
    m77user likes this.
  12. soundguy

    soundguy Well-Known Member

    May 8, 2012
    florida
    Ps.. I dont see load data from hodgdon for 150's ( 155 yes )

    155 data:


    Manufacturer:
    Hodgdon

    Powder:
    H414

    Bullet Diameter:
    .308"

    C.O.L.:
    2.775"

    Starting Load


    Grains:
    48.0

    Velocity (ft/s):
    2,625

    Pressure:
    40,500 CUP

    Maximum Load


    Grains:
    51.0

    Velocity (ft/s):
    2,793

    Pressure:
    50,200 CUP
     
  13. BobMcG

    BobMcG Well-Known Member Supporting Member

    If I am to understand what you're getting at is only neck resizing brass for each separate .308 rifle, no?
    Yes you could and I've done so in the past. However, while each round would be fire-formed/tailored for the chamber of one individual rifle, IMO it's not important at all in a normal hunting rifle (taking game within 200yds) and not even preferable in such an arm.
    In the case of squeezing every ounce you can out of a target rifle, that might be a different story.
     
    carver likes this.
  14. Firpo

    Firpo Well-Known Member Supporting Member

    Aug 29, 2013
    Yorba Linda, Ca
    Personally I full length size everything. I have a 1903 Springfield, 03A3 and a US M1917 that as you know are all 30-06 and I don't feel like keeping separate ammunition.
     
    ral357, SilasW and carver like this.
  15. Ethan Smith

    Ethan Smith New Member

    4
    Jan 7, 2017
    Sorry what I am trying to get at is seating depth. How far the bullet has to travel before it engages the rifling
     
    carver likes this.
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